Legions first approved Death Trooper

[cobra]

My point is, if they're of no allegiance, why then do they have a place in the 501st...this is absolutely retarded.

[SuperAzza101]

This costume getting approved makes me want to rage. We are not a bunch of riff raff that nobody has heard of, we are the 501st god damn Legion with a public image and an affiliation to Lucasfilm. We all know that not everybody is a full packet of chips, all it takes is for some bozo to decide to make one and wear it at an inappropriate place and in comes uncle George and we're in hot water.

Absolutely ridiculous.

[Agent Smith]

The thing that amazes me is that GL would have allowed this sort of thing in the first place..Its just so "off" I cant see how he would have been in favour of it.
I would not troop next to that "approved or not"

[Rents]

Never seen a Death trooper in the films nor in the books or games
Might try to get my Ballerina TB accepted

[Doc]

Never seen a Death trooper in the films nor in the books or games
Might try to get my Ballerina TB accepted

A white tutu for you mate

[Rents]

Never seen a Death trooper in the films nor in the books or games
Might try to get my Ballerina TB accepted

A white tutu for you mate

Your making me blush

[Angelman]

As a noobie it's not the sort of thing that attracted me to the 501st. Don't get me wrong, as a piece of creative art - it is outstanding, top effort. But for the kids and charities .... I'm sorry it's a no go, in my humble opinion.

[Moxxxie]

Angelman, I think most would agree with you.

My argument is - how do you know that a Zombie has allegiance with the Empire? From what I know about Zombies, their only allegiance is with Brains!!! BRAINS!!!!!.....

[oigen]

well clearly they would be imperial aligned because rebels and jedi's have all the brain which is another resource that the imperial overlords try to take from us as they are in very short supply

[stormtrooperguy]

Hello everyone,

I wanted to stop by to share my thoughts on some of the topics brought up here. I don't expect to change anyone's view on the deathtrooper, but do hope to explain the logic behind adding them to the 501st.

I'm going to try to hit all of the points brought up here but I'm typing on an iPhone so things may be a bit less well put together than I would like.

Deathtroopers were never supposed to be approved.

I'm not sure where that idea came from. The first deathtrooper submission was made last year. Lmo Spanos denied the costume, but stated that the character would be acceptable should one be built to the standard he described. My suit was based on what he said he would like to see. I am happy to dig out the actual quote when I am back on a full sized computer.

Abuse of power.

Several comments here.

First as stated above the decision to include the deathtrooper was made prior to our staff even considering taking office.

Second, don't think for a moment that LMO Rucci treats me better than anyone else. He denied my Fordo costume earlier this year just like he would have anyone else.

Last, this costume was built in accordance with the FISD developed crl, which I did not write.

As LMO it is difficult to do anything without someone, somewhere thinking it is an abuse of office. Before I took office I was a big proponent of experimenting with new to the legion costuming. I brought the first clone wars animated armor into the club, and the first clone wars mandalorian. Being lmo doesn't mean I'll stop doing that but I accept that there will be more scrutiny.

Regarding the references for the character.

The deathtroopers were introduced in the Lucasfilm authorized novel of the same name. It is a book about a zombie apocalypse scenario happening on a star destroyer.

Lucasfilm explicitly asked several of our socal garrison members to make deathtroopers to support their book tour. Lfl requested the bloodier the better.

It doesn't stop there. The deathtroopers are part of the Star Wars Galaxies game, the same source that gives us the nova troopers. There is an entire mission in the game dedicated to the deathtrooper arc.

Gentle giant has produced an excellent deathtrooper bust.

The second in the star wars horror book series has come out recently but I haven't read it yet.

In short, they have as much canon reference as many other eu characters. So while not characters well liked by all, we are not in the business of making value judgements on characters.


Wearing them to hospitals.

If you look at the work in progress crl at 501st.com you will see that there is a statement about the eligibility of them at various events. I should hope that our members and command staff are responsible enough to know what is and is not appropriate.

Regarding the hive of villainy.

This is a bit off topic but worth addressing.

That was put on hold by the Council not the command staff.

The reason is that the proposed dl does not have an applicable costume. He applied for the detachment while his Hett costume was still in discussion with the existing detachments.

Flagship Eclipse chose to embrace Hett as the predecessor of Krayt.

A detachment cannot be founded by someone who is not a member. Simple as that.

We are currently working on a number of issues related to this. We want these costumes to have a home as much as anyone.

I'll stop by again later when I have a full sized keyboard to discuss further.

[Torment]

Good Morning Red Back Garrison,

This thread was brought to my attention and I wanted to share some insight to those who are only seeing a costume and have an issue in understanding the approval process or may not agree with whats going on.

1st. The LMO of the last administration gave his approval of the costume if it was crafted correctly and followed the models of the game they came from. The game that the DT's were in was Star Wars Galaxies. They have also appeared in books, and also a bust by Gentle Giant.

2nd. The approval of this costume was based on the approval of other costumes that also came from this game. The Nova trooper, Nova Medic trooper, Swamp trooper are all approved characters in the Legion and all came from SWG.

3rd. We are foremost a costuming club, a club that does charity work. I know for many people they feel the charity comes first. But please remember you have to have a costume to get in the 501st. It's not about how much charity you do. And please don't read into this as I am against charity or that the 501st does it. I do tons of work with many events over the years.

When this costume came up for formal approval I had to ask myself these questions. Does it fall in line with previous approval types? Does the character have validity in the SWU? Is there enough reference to show a full body interpretation of the character?

1. Yes it does as many of the characters we approve today like the TK commander, the Nova trooper are also video game characters and we approve them.

2. Yes it does have validity in the SWU as a character as it was created by LFL and not by some random person. It not only has one licensed reference, but many. It is no less valid a character than a TKC.

3. Yes there is plenty of reference material out there for this character as it has been supported by many different licenses.

When I look at those elements the next element is costume quality. The suit is defiantly a quality build and I think it would be hard pressed to say otherwise. This particular costume may not be your cup of tea, but it meets all the requirements to be a legion costume.

These are requirements that have been long standing before our term as LMO's, and something I feel that will surpass us when we are no longer in the role. The major difference between this year and past, is we finally took all the rules and wrote them down to be held to them. You can see the LMO approval policies here...

http://www.501st.com/databank/LMO_Documentation

We took a decade and a half of passed down rules and formalized them. In writing them down finally, we removed the debating issue of weather or not something is in fact true or not.

What I have gathered over the last two pages of reading is people dont like the costume itself as a character. For that, I am sorry you don't like the character. But it does meet all the guidelines that would make it a legion costume.

Many people continue to bring up hospitals as well. What worries me more about this comment is you have contended the common sense of people. Even in my own notation to the GML's I noted that this suit is one that warrants common sense. It is not appropriate for all events. Con's, zombie walks, ect. It would be great for. I agree its not a hospital suit. But that is a common sense issue. It was also noted in my approval that this costume should be addressed to any event host or organizer as a common sense precaution.

Common sense plays a role into a lot of what we do. We have plenty of characters from the star wars universe that are just simply inappropriate for events. Darth Talon, Oola, Slave Leia, and many others. But we dont seem to ever get up in arms really over these.

I don't want to seem like a heavy and come in and rain down control, but I thought it needed to be explained that this costume has just as good a reason to be in the 501st as any other approved into the Legion. If you continue to dislike the costume that is fine. It just might not be for you. Ill never do a Scout cause they just aren't my favorite character. We can all agree to disagree on things like that. But know that what I have done at the legion level is followed along with all of the previous rules, guidelines, and precedents before me.

I wish you all well, and as always if anyone ever has a question you can always contact me and I am happy to answer questions as best I can.

[stormtrooperguy]

As promised, I am back with the quote from the initial Deathtrooper review on 21 Jun 2010

Applicant's names removed from the text.

When considering an Expanded Universe character for membership, it is important to identify the best reference. For a character whose visual appearance is based on a video game, the high resolution model becomes the source. The Death Trooper is no exception;





These images represent the visual source file for the character. Oozing blood might be over top for some. Notice that LFL was careful not to have oozing blood on their base model. Instead the entire suit is distressed and damaged with a gangrenous palour. And once more, there's no blood. The face is contorted and decayed.

For 501st consideration, I will be looking for costumes to match the SWG base model (above.) Additionally, any exposed flesh will need to be treated with zombie prosthetic or facial paint.



If these standards are met, I will fully support the inclusion of the Death Trooper.
The opinion was voiced that there are no 501st events for such characters. Perhaps not at visits to the burn ward of an orphanage. For many other events, such as most any convention that 501st might participate in such a hypothetical costume would be fine.

About the concern that approval of such character might grant open license to members to use bad judgement and wear inappropriate costumes to sensitive events. First, events that have selective criteria should be listed as such. Up until this year Disney's prohibited the 501st's EU costumers from participating in Star Wars Weekends. Members who attempted to circumvent the event's policy were turned back by 501st coordinators. Members who intentionally create problems can face suspension and even expulsion under the rules of our charter. It really is no different than some one in a screen accurate and G-canon TK going out to an event and causing an expulsion worthy incident. It is not the costume, but the character of the being inside.
126. and 131. Status; Deferred. Character is now open for consideration, but will need to match the LFL originating base model.

[Tirilia]

Thanks for clarifying guys,

Like I said, the only thing that irks me about it is that the undersuit looks sparkly clean whilst the rest of the armor looks like its been burried for years. Makes it look a little unfinished. But calls like that arent up to lil ole members like me, thats up to LMO's and costume judges. Sorry if Im wrong about the undersuit, the pic we have on page 1 is all I have to go by.

[Rents]

A Star Wars zombie comic..........
Wrong wrong wrong on all accounts

[Agent Smith]

Thanks for the clarification guys, I think the work that has gone into it is great, But the whole idea of zombie troopers......well..., perhaps a bit more thought should have gone into it.